To further elaborate, I'm trying to ease myself on my future surgery (idk when that will be) including the aspect of dilation. I've heard for some people it's incredibly painful, so much so it's too much to handle and the canal ends up closing. I've heard from other that's it's literally just a chance to watch TV. I know everyone's body's are different including healing, complications, etc, but I want to hear realistically what I'm getting into. Any advice is appreciated as for the past 2 years I've been considering minjmal depth.
Barring the rare complications, is dilation really as terrible and grueling as people make it out to be?
From my experience, it's not pain that gives it the reputation it has. It is the absolutely life-controlling frequency of which you need to partake in a 40-60 minute + private activity.
Even at only 2/day 3 months post-op you pretty much can't make any evening or multi-day plans unless you plan on packing 2 9" long hard plastic rods, lube, and a douche bulb. Certainly not something you're just casually taking to a friend's place.
Also really depends on your living situation. Early on a lot of the hardship can be mitigated by having someone help you prep and clean everything, or keep you company during the process. In my case, I have a small bedroom in an apartment I split with my roommate. Given it's a shared space with someone other than a partner, it's not like I have the freedom to go dilate on the couch and watch something.
Additionally, your bed/room is essentially a biohazardous write-off as you're sleeping on mattress pads and you'll inevitably get lube and other fluids on things during your numerous dilations/day. The sickening sweet lube smell mixed with the healing smells early on is certainly a recipe to become incredibly self conscious.
It's one hell of a recovery process, well worth it of course, but I find it's the mountain of little non-bodily things that really make it a pain.
Ok, what lube are you using? I use the classic water based KY and it doesn't smell. And are you putting down a puppy pad or anything? Those work really well at keeping lube/fluids off your stuff
Actually the same lube I've been using! Didn't have any issues with the smell of it at first, but 11 weeks in I find it sickening. It's not an objectively "bad" smell, but sniffing the dilators after use makes me nauseous. Think I may have just developed an association with the smell and the uncomfortable experience of dilation that makes the smell repulsive, it's happened to me in the past we certain perfumes around traumatic experiences.
I have no issues with my "end of the day" scent down there either. Very similar to the cis women I've been with.
And yeah I'm on a puppy pad, I just realllly make sure I'm hitting my max depth of ~7" so there is lube at the base of the dilator that gets on my hands, I also bump my fingers against the lips commonly.
You said this very correctly about dilating , ha ! I started out Scrotal PI 2019 and had to upgrade to Sigmoid-Colon ( new seat covers for my car ) fall 2022 but it's a necessary evil even with Sigmoid because of the attachment sutures for he outside skin to Sigmoid keeping the area stretched - technically a circular scar healing point inside - just do it .
It's true about lube and smell - a few times I thought WTF ! If I can smell it, others can also ! My solution post dilating was using a flexible long shower head on low streaming and flush everything out with warm water with a light jet stream and have never had a smell since.
Would it make sense for partners to plan to sleep in another bed during the 3 months post op?
I'd say that really comes down to you and your partner's comfort levels.
If you have an existing long-term partner that isn't bothered by the prospect of being around your abnormal bodily fluids you're all good.
Realistically, if you kept to your own sides of the bed, and you slept on a mattress pad, the underside should at least be pretty self contained, but you're meant to sleep commando as much as possible which ensures your upper sheet will get marked up in various places.
If you stay on top of laundry I'm sure you could make it work, but the first month is preeeety messy and the smell early on with all the fibrin, blood, etc was something that I didn't want ANYONE in my room, let alone my bed. So I'd probably say you should plan on a seperate bed for the first month.
I'm 11 weeks post and only just starting to have nights where I wake up to clean bedding. Still not at the point where I'd consider sharing my bed with anyone other than a long-term partner (which is quite unfortunate because I'm touch starved as hell) š
Bedding aside, I've just been really self conscious even just existing in the vicinity of my roommates out of fear I'll leak on something or they pick up on the smell. It's been getting better the past couple weeks but I imagine it'll still be a couple months before I'm really comfortable again
More reasons to not want the surgery
If you don't want surgery, why are you on the surgery page?
Because Iām 50/50 on the fence if I want to complete my transition by getting bottom surgery
Obvs its a very individual journey and a huge decision, but my only advice would be: Don't let a potentially icky speed-bump stop you overcoming a mountain thats troubled you for years. The view when you get to the top will all have been worth it.
The key reason for wanting it or not is simply which configuration you'd prefer for the rest of your life.
Personally, despite these annoyances, I've been the happiest I've ever been and actually feel right in my own body. I know that in another 3 months I'll have my life back to normal as well, so it's only uphill from here :D
Losing 3-6 months of my conventional life for potentially decades of an enhanced life... No brainer for me.
But hey, other girls genuinely enjoy being no-op! Being able to be happy with my body without all of this surgical recovery would have been AWESOME. Just not a reality for me.
Like a part of me wants it because it might help alleviate my genital dysphoria but another part of is telling me that maybe HRT will do that on its own.
Ultimately it comes down wishing I could be pregnant
Ah yeah. 2.5 years into HRT myself and I had an orchiectomy prior to my GCS in hopes that would be enough to resolve my bottom dysphoria, it did help, but simply wasn't enough.
Certainly understand that desire though š
Patience sweetie, women who were born without uterusās now have the ability to get a uterus implant. There has even been a couple of women (though in the Uk) who have been able to get invitro and carry the baby up until full term. Now they are considered high risk pregnancies and are required to have the baby through C-section.
I honestly feel that 5 years from now, we may have the same sort of option to get the uterus implants and carry children of our own to term.
Because just like you, I strive for the opportunity to get pregnant and carry a child to term (even though I currently have 2 children of my own)
So keep your head up and have faith that your wildest dreams may become a reality with just enough faith in the possibility
I have only been dilating for two weeks so far, so obviously it's very early days. However it has not been painful. It is uncomfortable and between prep and clean up it takes time but has been going better than expected. For reference I am currently using the purple soul source one and can get it all the way into the last dot with minimal fuss. Holding it there for 15 minutes is probably going to start to get old quickly.
It has not been bad for me at all. I had also been so intimidated by dilating because of the stories I read, but that has not matched my experience.
I have a little box next to the bed that has my supplies, primarily: - a small waterproof blanket (it was advertised as a sex rug, basically. It's a circle about 2 feet in diameter) - small puppy pads (they don't need to be big. Sometimes I drip onto it, but it's not like lube and stuff is shooting everywhere) - a little mirror with a light that stands up on its own - some water wipes - my dilators - lube (I use the regular water based KY jelly. I go back and forth between the liquid and the gel, I haven't decided which I like best yet)
For the first month it takes some work to get the hang of it, and it can be tougher, but by the 4-6 week mark it was just another chore. I dilate when I get up around 7, sometime in the afternoon (ideally around 3:30, but if I'm in the office or out and about then as late as 6-8), and then before bed around 11. It takes about 2 minutes to wash my hands, lay out the blanket/pad, get lubed up and inserted, I dilate for 23 minutes, and then it takes about 5 minutes to wipe up with the water wipe and wash my dilators. I spend half an hour looking at my phone when I wake up and before bed anyway, so it has only slightly changed my routine. The afternoon one can be annoying, but it's not forever - anecdotally it seems that people have dropped to 2x a day by the year mark, if not before.
Sometimes it's a little sore, but it's not bad, and my surgeon prescribed clobetasol, which helps. But yeah, overall an annoyance, but it's not a grueling slog. Once they're in I just sit there and read or look at my phone. For me it's not a big deal
can i ever stop dilating or is this a lifelong process? i just cant wrap my head around this whole stuff and why dilation just continues to be a process even after a year?
This will depend on the person but mostly the frequency decreases as time goes on.
With McGinn I was 4x a day for the first 6ish weeks then 3x a day until 6months. I'm now at 2x a day. From speaking to other patients of hers, most are able to move to every other day somewhere before the first year and 1x per week before the second year. It mostly depends on listening to your body.
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which surgeon was it?
My surgical packet from MGH says once a week after 9 months. Not crazy onerous.
The frequency decreases but it is a lifelong task.
4 weeks post-op PIV here!
At first it was moderately painful when entering due to swelling and some minor wound separation, but I managed it with Tylenol and it has started to become pleasurable.
The biggest "thing" about it is just that it adds another to-do item that you have to manage into your schedule each day.
I am three years post surgery and I dilate every other day. To me it's not a hassle and it ensures I don't lose any depth. My surgeon recommended dilating once a week after one year. I did start to lose some depth. Every other day seems right for me. I couldn't wait to only dilate weekly, but now it's no big deal and there is no pain.
Do your individual sessions go faster now that youāre three years out? How much time do you spend?
I spend 10 minutes on each dilator. I don't start timing unless they are all the way in. So I spend around 45 minutes. If I miss a few days, it's no big deal. There is no pain, maybe enjoyment.
I think the biggest hurdle is that you go from never having to dilate to the worst dilation schedule you will ever have in a single day with no ramp up period. And it starts when you're in a fairly significant amount of pain.
Most complaints I've seen and had are with the 4/day and 3/day schedule. Once you're down to 2 it seems like a relief, so not many complain about it. Then before you know it, once a day, then less than that. Eventually you can go on a week long trip to the Bahamas and not even have to take your kit with you.... Especially if you have a bf or toys.
I'm 8 months post-op. My experience of dilation was that initially it was stressful because there's a lot of new sensations and not knowing what means what and sometimes you bleed and that can all just be stressful. After all that passes, the shit part isn't that it hurts (it can be a little sore from time to time) it's that it just.. takes up so much time. And you don't really get to take a day off. Like if you're feeling kinda down one day? Tough, time to dilate. You have to keep on top of it and be consistent. Missing the very occasional session (like no more than once a week, probably more like once a month in the first 6 months and not at all during the first month or two) is okay but like by-and-large it's just the huge, mandatory time-sink of shoving hard plastic rods up yourself. Its not painful but it's not exactly fun.
Out of curiosity, and anyone here can answer this, are you allowed to say, use biker shorts to keep the rods in yourself longer and maintain dilation throughout the day?
Iām going through the procedure this fall and posts like this help to answer many questions.
I wouldn't do this when walking around. You can get wearable dilators though, but they don't dilate the parts that need dilating.
Suporn clinic gives a like rubber sheet to let you hold the dilators in in a way that is easier on the hands so maybe in theory when dilating itself but honestly just use your hands
Thank you! I appreciate your answer. Naturally, lots of question pre-op
11 weeks post op, Iāve read a few comments and I agree and disagree with some points. The first month I did make a mess, I had to leave a puppy pad under me when I was dilating, but I was using ky jelly which isnāt the best, and there was a little smell. That all went away after the first month. I switched to an aloe lube that removed almost all the smell and excess discharge. Also started doing lacto bacillus douches once a week that makes me smell like a natural vagina, and helps keep me clean. I try to shower every night and rinse down there with my shower head but I skip every few nights out of laziness and have been fine. Since then I was told to dilate 3 times a day for 20 mins but only do it twice a day. I go lay in bed and use the second biggest for 10mins and the largest for 10 mins. They normally go in really easy, I have to hold them in to keep them from slipping out most of the time. Sometime there is a slight discomfort, possibly pain if I had been very active the day before. Generally itās not bad at all though. Also you really only need a drop of lube, just enough to easily slide the dilator in, if you use too much it can cause you to make a mess. I skip dilation sessions every now and then too and have been fine, just a little tighter than normal the next session. Traveling is also not as bad as people make it seem. My dilators come in a nice travel kit, and then I just bring a few pads and a little travel size bottle of lube. It all fits very nicely in a book bag, or larger purse. Then I dilate 20 mins in the morning and 20mins at night. I hardly notice or let it impact my day. Itās really just an excuse to consume content on my phone guilt free. I wouldnāt go camping right now, but as long as I have a private room, and somewhere to wash them I could travel anywhere I wanted. I also didnāt have a good healing journey, Iāve had multiple complications, and ended up in the er once, but they all resolved themselves, and I never had any issues with dilating besides an occasional tear near the opening that stung a little before it closed up. You will be fine and I think risking the very small chance of recurring pain is worth the ability to have a canal. Dilating can definitely be a pain but Iām looking forward to the year out when I only have to do it once a week!
about when did you start using the lacto bacillus?
I started taking a probiotic before my surgery and thru the first month of recovery. I read a study that showed trans women who took the supplement orally showed measurable amounts of it in their neo vagina. I figured it wouldnāt hurt to try. I was going to start one you place directly in the canal, but my surgeon suggested taking my probiotics and dissolving them into a douche and applying it that way. So Iāve been doing that once a week since about a 6 weeks out. I definitely notice a yogurt smell.
Which probiotic is that, then? Thanks š
Itās just a generic feminine health probiotic, just need one that has a few different strains of lacto-bacillus bacteria in it. Iām not sure if it matters if it has a prebiotic mixed in. I also am not familiar with any brands that work better than any other. I just get the first one I find that just has the bacteria and not a bunch of other junk. Sorry if I wasnāt more helpful. There are a few different scientific papers where they tested it and it shows pretty good results. The only issues is you have to keep reapplying the bacteria because there is nothing for them to feed on in the neo vagina. A cis vagina produces a mucus from the lining that they normally feed on. I believe, Iām not a doctor lol. So Iāve been using a natural ph balanced lube made from aloe and Iām hoping they can live in/ eat that stuff and survive longer. They basically produce hydrogen peroxide and make the canal inhospitable to other nasty smelling bacteria like fecal bacteria. Also take everything im saying with a grain of salt, I just skimmed thru a few research studies. I suggest you do your own research as well.
I appreciate the info though.. thanks! I was just wondering if it was something specific since you said you were dissolving them. Maybe I misunderstood, but I was trying to figure out how you did that and if only some of the pills would dissolve.
I break open the capsules and pour the contents in luke warm water in the bulb of the douche.
Thanks!
6 months post op. Never had pain, just tightness when sizing up and around 12 weeks when your scar tissue contracts a bit. That's the most important time to stick to dilation as it's very easy to lose depth early on if you slack.
Currently on twice a day but can do once a day. Large carrot (orange soul source) for 30 mins and then 10 mins clean up and douche. Take your time with sizing up. I'm glad I did as i had no exterior granulation and no revision needed. As long as you mantain depth, Width can always come.
Almost a year post op, and honestly, dilation is more just annoying than anything. For me, it was a little uncomfortable for the first few months as everything healed, but since then, it's really just been an annoying reason to get up earlier in the morning š
It is definitely a good reason to just sit and chill and watch TV, though! I think the only thing that annoys me is that it requires one hand, so you can't use the time to like play video games or anything that would require more than one hand.
To expand on the OP's question: I'm having a little trouble finding a consice answer to this part: what is the long-term schedule? Like, when does it become 1/week, bi-weekly, what does it ultimately end up being long-term, etc?
There isn't one. Every surgeon team is making it up as they go based on what they read and experience. I'm 5 weeks post-op and my schedule from the surgeon is WAY different than what most people are posting here.
Generally the goal is to get down to once a week. Each surgeon has a different timeframe for that to happen. It sounds like the average is about a year to drop below 1/day. At that point, listen to your body and watch your depth and girth. If it starts reducing, increase again. And by reducing, I mean if the dot that used to be comfortably inside is now barely inside, increase frequency or duration. Don't wait until it's more than that. It's easiest to recover before it gets really noticable.
Also consider that each individual heals differently. For example, I don't get keloid scars at all, but others do. All of these things factor into the overall dilation schedule. There are general guidelines, but it's really down to the individual and the surgical team.
6 months out..dilation 4 of those months was a mildly uncomfortable annoyance that I'm mostly just sick of taking up time.
I was unlucky though and had a 2 months period of intense contracture (when the scar tissue ring tried to tighten and heal fully) that was extremely painful. I got very tight and actually caused a fissure near my entrance. The healing granulation from that made dilating an eye wateringly painful experience for awhile. I almost quit and did end up losing some progress width wise (almost back to the largest dilator though!).
It really varies from person to person, if you are lucky you will have little granulation and a short or non-existent contracture period and the entire thing will just be a boring routine.
Itās been 10 months for me. Iām almost done. After about 5 months the swelling is all gone, and itās mostly just ritual.
In the beginning it was very unpleasant and hard to fit in. I am back to working 10 hours a day everyday, and now itās kinda nice to just be in a private space for a bit each day.
it's been uncomfortable at times, especially at first, but you get into a habit/rhythm and it gets easier. honestly, i look at it as "i get to put something inside me and that is incredibly euphoria generating."
Depends on your pain tolerance. Mine very high so it didn't bother me, but as others say it becomes something you have to do and get used to doing. I have a setup now where I dilate 30 mins and just read or watch videos on my phone while I have a timer. The longest gap I've gone is 12 to 14 hours apart between dilations at 2 months post op. It's sore or swollen but I have no issue slowly working the dilator in. Now the first time after a long gap I'll use the smaller of the 2 I'm on to get started with 25 mins, then my second dilation of the day I'll go back to both. Pushing yourself or holding pressure with your legs will make you tense up so you have to make sure you're propped up properly and as relaxed as you can be.
Dilation was a bit unconformable but that was due to granulation, now after silver nitrate treatment it isn't so bad.
To echo many others, its not painful per say (if it is, you may have normal complications that need to be addressed), it is consistently uncomfortable and rules your life for a long time. One piece of advice I'll give - unless you're dealing with some sort of wound, KEEP UP WITH YOUR DILATION SCHEDULE. Be consistent with it, and follow directions. Take dilation seriously, otherwise you put yourself at risk of way worse issues.
Painful, not really, it's pretty uncomfortable at times, and upscaling in dilators can be a bit of ummm, fun. But as others have said, it's the time. It's an hour, setup, doing, cleanup, and everything gets sticky, smelly etc.
I would suggest a washable puppy pad, I swear by these, I bought 4 for $30au, and they've lasted me 2 months, are larger than disposable ones, and easy to chuck in the machine to wash.
So after 75 days (surgery was 6th March.)
Dilated 126 times (suppose to be twice per day, but take away 6 days post surgery, 1 day travel, but there are days that I've only dilated once.
I've currently dilated (from time I put the dilator in until I removed it) 92 hours. I've found it pretty easy to get to depth, and have lost maybe a 1/4 of an inch at most.
It's a commitment, it's pretty tough to maintain the schedule, there are days I go, fuck it, mental health miss, but I make sure I dilate each day.
I had PIV surgery with Bowers in February 2018. I never had a lot of depth (something like 3.5ā) due I guess to not a lot of material. I havenāt dilated at all for many years and it has been fine. I go through periods with a lot of sex, and periods with very little. Itās still always fine. So for me, there is no schedule and it is not a chore at all.
I have never had pain during dilation and am 12 weeks post op and sized up dilators aggressively (exceeding soul source sizes). You hear more about the people who have trouble because that's more interesting to talk about.
4 months out at 2x a day with orange soulsource here.
It's not really that bad tbh. At first, it's a day job, but once you're down to two times a day, it's more of a minor annoyance than anything.
Dilation has never been painful, per se, just pressure at times. The 4 times per day was daunting for me, personally. Between the prep, the duration, and the clean up, it felt like that is all I was doing. Now that Iām down to 1-2 times per day itās less daunting but still a chore at timesā¦ sometimes I just want to sleep in or just go to bed but canāt.
It depends. I'm about 10 months out from surgery. It was horrible for the first few weeks. Then it got easy for a couple months. Then it got horrible again. And now it's getting easier again.
The worst will always be the first year. After some time you'll heal more and you can dilate less often, so it gets easier. Most people can eventually go down to once a week, or stop entirely if they're being penetrated by a sexual partner often enough. It's not a guarantee, but it is likely that dilation won't be a huge problem your whole life.
It depends! For me it was hell. I had severe stricture/stenosis leading to a permanent closure of the canal. Dilating after the first 3 months got HARDER due to what Wittenberg references as a tightening phase when scarring really starts and muscles start clamping down.
But basically it was EASY the first 3 months with little to no discomfort or pain after the first few dilations. But after 3 months, every single dilation no matter how often I did it was uncomfortable at the very least or painful at the worst. Anytime I slipped up or missed or reduced my dilation schedule it got way worse and way harder. It was borderline impossible to INCREASE or regain width in my case, minor-severe pain if I tried, especially further on in the structure/stenosis process. Then it closed up at the year 1/2-2yr mark. I did PPT. I am 3 years post op now.
But if I was stricter RIGHT when it started tightening, maybe I could have prevented it. I reduced my dilation schedule based on the surgeon and most recommendations but I really shouldnāt have. That 3-6 month period before the stricture really set in I could have possibly prevented the pain and misery from 6months-year and 1/2 if I maintained the immediate postop dilation schedule for longer.
For me No. I've only been doing it for 3 weeks now and am doing the green one part time. My biggest pain in the ass is I'm not home yet and it's a hassle putting everything up and digging it back out and so on every time, whereas if I was home I live alone and could be more user friendly.
I'll be home sweet home Thursday after being gone for 6 weeks for surgery. Can't wait.
Hug's Emily š¤
It's not painful at all but that is because I got the colonic vaginoplasty but it is very uncomfortable just having something that long in you for an hour everyday
I just pulled the dilator out seconds ago. I do it twice a day for 15 minutes. It becomes a routine and itās not terrible. At least for me. Itās very easy.
Is there a dilating āmanualā that all surgeons use and share with their patients? Or, is the routine variable depending on individual circumstances? Iām just curious if we all use the same standard, method and timing.
Reposting this answer I made. There isn't one. Every surgeon team is making it up as they go based on what they read and experience. I'm 5 weeks post-op and my schedule from the surgeon is WAY different than what most people are posting here.
ymmv and there isn't a way to tell if you'll be unlucky
As you point out, everyoneās experience is different - Ā but for me, and Iāve been dilating going on 4.5months, it isnāt painful. It can be uncomfortable, particularly in the first 2 weeks as I got used to it, but Iāve learnt to relax the pelvic muscles and go slightly slower if I begin to feel that discomfort. While it gets frustrating having to dilate so often, Iām presently dilating twice a day for 20-30 mins each time, it does give me an opportunity to relax and watch some TV.
Yes, the dilation can be gruesome experience especially if you get the Thai technique.
17 days post-op here. In general agreement with the other comments, I get very minimal pain and more discomfort. The issue is the faff and having to plan your days around dilations (plus the cleaning), but you do get used to that. That's why you need the time off everything for the first ten weeks, it will be dedicated to recovery and maintenance.
Oh, and incontinence pads for your bed are an absolute godsend.
In the beginning it sucks.
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