Does Voice Feminization Surgery get better as time goes on?

38
u/FlodaReltih45
Mon Aug 12 15:28:52 2024 UTC
(27 comments)

I'm doing some research on VFS done in places like S. Korea, Turkïye, etc.

The before and after sorta left the patients sounding like Harvey Feirsrein, with like a raspy voice and whatnot.

An example of a friend from the Philippines sent me had a clinic where they showed the before and after of patients—and the post 7-day op patients had the same raspy voice (im just gonna leave the entire playlist as example)

Some underwent a few voice therapy sessions—in the same hospital they underwent the surgery in—before they sounded like full women.

Another example I wanna talk about are VFS surgeons in Turkïye who seem to have very magical results like these

Like this is the sort of results I want to achieve.

But a lot of assumptions have sorta left my mind to doubt and ask questions.

Namely how long did it take for them to recover and get their voices to sound like that?

Also were these the only patients, or were these the successful patients and the ones with lackluster or even terrible outcomes are forced to live with the surgery because they signed a waiver?

All in all, I'm sorta afraid I'll sound like Harvey Feirstein tbh.

all 27 comments



25
u/SlateRaven
Mon Aug 12 17:14:25 2024 UTC
(11 children)

I had VFS with Dr. Courey at Mount Sinai last year, so I can chime in!

The first 6 weeks are rough - I sounded like a sultry grandma who smoked for 40 years. After the stitches dissolved around the 6 week mark, my voice got significantly better and quickly at that. By the 12 week mark, it was natural sounding but still had inflammation here and there, so long periods of talking usually made me a tad sore for a day. At the 6 month mark, I'd say I was 100% but still figuring out little things with my voice - fine tuning, if you will.

At the 1 year mark, I realized I never think about my voice - it's so fluid and natural. I've been to queer meetups where people thought I was there as an ally, lesbian, or something, but never trans. Even other trans people wouldn't catch on until I talked about my transition lol

Edit: note that I saw an SLP who specialized in helping trans people. I saw him for almost 2 years prior to VFS and he was the one who figured out I had prior vocal cord damage that prevented me from getting good pitch. I continued training with him for about 6 months post-op until we both realized that my voice fit me perfectly and I wasn't having any issues.

2
Mon Aug 12 17:35:32 2024 UTC
(1 child)

What caused your prior vocal cord damage?

3
Mon Aug 12 17:40:17 2024 UTC
(0 children)

Not entirely sure, but it was an outer fold issue that prevented me creating tension, as well as causing me to talk with glottal fry without me being able to control it much. My VFS was pretty standard but Courey did a couple extra things to help with the prior damage that he found during our consult.

If I had to guess, I talked incorrectly for so long that my voice was damaged from misuse. My SLP said it's something he deals with all the time.

2
Tue Aug 13 06:10:24 2024 UTC
(2 children)

SLP ?

2
Tue Aug 13 10:22:27 2024 UTC
(1 child)

Speech Language Professional

1
Tue Aug 13 10:35:14 2024 UTC
(0 children)

Ah, of course! Thankyou 🙂

2
Tue Aug 13 17:44:23 2024 UTC
(5 children)

Ok that convinced me I am gonna get VFS haha thank you.

2
Tue Aug 13 17:46:46 2024 UTC
(4 children)

It's a case by case thing and it only affects pitch for the most part. The only thing I had issues with was pitch, Al it made sense. Make sure you get a good comprehensive consult and see what they say. They can tell you if you need to work more on brightness, weight, etc...

2
Tue Aug 13 18:00:14 2024 UTC
(3 children)

Definitely thank you! I have been voice training for a year and its hard getting my pitch up. Ill give it another year of vocal training and see where I am at. Thank you so much ❤️

2
Tue Aug 13 18:04:07 2024 UTC
(2 children)

Do you have a formal SLP? if not, it may not hurt to see one and state your intentions. Also, most VFS surgeons have in-house SLP's that you'll work with prior to VFS, so that's an option.

1
Tue Aug 13 20:44:51 2024 UTC
(0 children)

I do have a SLP I see bi weekly, she is pretty good but she didn’t seem to keen on me getting VFS. The biggest thing she mentioned to me to was not see a plastic surgeon for VFS and see a Doc that instead specialized in VFS.

1
Tue Aug 13 20:45:22 2024 UTC
(0 children)

I do have a SLP I see bi weekly, she is pretty good but she didn’t seem to keen on me getting VFS. The biggest thing she mentioned to me to was not see a plastic surgeon for VFS and see a Doc that instead specialized in VFS.

18
u/Throwaway30957223534
Mon Aug 12 15:52:19 2024 UTC
(0 children)

Funny I see this post now. I was just in a trans discord last night and a new girl was in voice chat with us. I had no clue she was trans until she started talking about her transition and having had voice surgery in South Korea. I didn't get much more info than that, so I hope that helps.

14
u/meikkyo
Mon Aug 12 15:54:05 2024 UTC
(0 children)

i haven't looked too deeply into vfs, but patients from my local vfs surgeon (who uses yeson techniques) aren't even supposed to really speak at all until at least 2 weeks to a month after surgery. i think patients generally also need to do additional voice training to adjust to their post-surgery voice.

9
u/Cosmic-Space-Octopus
Mon Aug 12 16:13:11 2024 UTC
(2 children)

It can take 6 weeks for the voice to start sounding feminine after surgery. Up to a year for hoarsenes to go away.

3
OP
Mon Aug 12 16:27:48 2024 UTC
(1 child)

Is there any possibility that after a year that hoarseness will go away and it'll sound more natural?

2
Mon Aug 12 19:24:49 2024 UTC
(0 children)

Yes, Usually.

4
u/enbyous_analog
Mon Aug 12 16:46:23 2024 UTC
(2 children)

So I am roughly 1 year posed VFS. Certainly my voice has been evolving... I definitely have issues with chronic inflammation which lower the frequency. I can do some vocal warm ups early in the day and have a pretty high frequency for the rest of the day, but then I go to sleep and the next morning I wake up low again.

Also if I take an anti-inflammatory such as prednisone then I will shoot all the way up to 200 to 220 Hertz when I tend to wake up around 140 Hertz. That's a pretty dramatic difference just from inflammation.

My hope is that in another year or two the chronic inflammation may reduce, but I have to wonder if some of it may be autoimmune modulations from COVID exposure or vaccinations or other things. For example I didn't really have allergy issues until more recently. That is pretty common these days. My ex-wife and trans sister both have autoimmune diseases that they didn't have before the pandemic.

1
Mon Aug 12 18:09:08 2024 UTC
(1 child)

Heya! Given that your voice improves with warm ups then worsens after sleeping, I imagine that you've either got acid reflux or post nasal drip from allergies, or both. Prednisone is a potent anti-inflammatory in a general sense, but it also does wonders for allergies... which kinda makes me wonder if you've got an allergy issue. Something worth looking into.

1
Tue Aug 13 19:21:11 2024 UTC
(0 children)

Yeah I also take a 24-hour allergy tablet everyday. I noticed that combining allergy tablets and ibuprofen helps... But not as much as Prednisone. I don't have acid reflux or post nasal drip. Everyone's voice is a little bit rougher when they first wake up. Could also be related to just fluids in the body equalizing more from being horizontal.

4
u/Vyn-00
Mon Aug 12 17:36:11 2024 UTC
(0 children)

I had VFSRAC with Yeson and I'm about 6 months post. I had anterior commissure detachment from an overly agressive tracheal shave. My average was around 125hz, and I could barely get to 165 and I had a ton of vocal cord spasm. Now I speak around 180 naturally, and with minor effort 210. I'm still dealing with a good bit of vocal spasm, and have been recommended to do another botox injection, but I just haven't had a chance to get that done.

Anecdotally, my voice pitch continues to become higher as the vocal spasms go away. I feel like I naturally avoid higher frequencies because I can't produce a lot of volume and my voice will probably crack.

4
u/VeeStuff
Mon Aug 12 17:51:47 2024 UTC
(0 children)

4 months post VFS with Dr. Yung. No regrets whatsoever. Gained over 100hz in pitch. Was gravelly for the first 8-10 weeks, now smoothing out and very happy. Still a bit breathy, and will remain that way, but so happy!

4
u/Era_of_Clara
Mon Aug 12 20:03:35 2024 UTC
*
(0 children)

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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

3
u/TheWomanita
Mon Aug 12 23:40:24 2024 UTC
(0 children)

I had surgery with Yeson 6 years ago and it's the best thing I've done for myself. I don't feel self conscious when I speak anymore. The first 5 months were tough but my voice steadily increased in pitch. Now I speak comfortably around the 200-220hz average. It can go higher up to 240 or low to 180 depending on the mood. But yeah keep in mind that's just the average. I don't make many sounds lower than 180 but I can definitely reach 400hz easily if I'm excited. I tend to be quite chill though 😁

u/[deleted]
Tue Aug 13 06:35:40 2024 UTC
(1 child)

[deleted]

3
u/AnnaSvl
Mon Aug 12 16:47:41 2024 UTC
(0 children)

You're not supposed to speak at all for 1-2 month after surgery in South Korea (Yeson). Check out their YT channel https://youtube.com/@yesonvoicecenter they have lots and lots of results there. A lot of threads about them here too. Although my assessment is 3 years old at this point, they seemed to be great and they were my choice, but COVID happened, Korea was in lockdown till 22, by then I had no money for the surgery, so I never went.

0
u/GrandApprehensive216
Tue Aug 13 08:01:25 2024 UTC
(1 child)

Sounds dangerous. I rather just take voice lessons