Somebody affiliated with Facial Team blackmailing and defaming Dr Bart van de Ven

23
u/2pass_Clinic Works for 2pass Clinic, Belgium
Works for 2pass Clinic, Belgium
Sat Jan 18 15:52:43 2020 UTC
(19 comments)

This is the official statement from Dr Bart van de Ven and his team as a reaction to the post of Mona Maier https://www.reddit.com/r/Transgender_Surgeries/comments/emp72a/alert_experience_forehead_reconstruction_2pass_vd/ .

We want to reach out because we can’t let someone instil fear in people/patients with threats and false accusations. Patients are forever and always free to not be happy with their results and to write about their experience, but this is much more than that. This is a case of blackmail and defamation because of personal interests. There is so much false information in the initial post that we feel we have to set it straight with the facts, in the protection of current and future patients.

1. Mona Maier works for Facial Team and blackmailed Dr Bart van de Ven

The first fact is that Mona Maier, the person representing the patient in this case, blackmailed us demanding 12,000 euros or she would slander Dr Bart van de Ven’s name online (see email: https://imgur.com/a/Z8DVB4r ).

Translated in English the email says:

"Dr. van de Ven,

I hereby give you the last opportunity to pay the amount of 12 000.00 into my account - which you are aware of - as compensation and compensation for pain and suffering within 7 working days.

Your ridiculous answer is not worth the letters.

If you are not able to pay the compensation, I will immediately use all channels to publicize your fraudulent actions and misleading presentation of your surgery on your website, to the general public, including the print media, not to mention the setup of your company."

We did not comply since we do not have anything to hide, and the claims on which the blackmail was based are false. We consulted with our own lawyers, who send a warning to Mona Maier. We informed her that legal action would be taken for the fact of blackmail and slander since that is simply not okay.

Mona Maier works for FacialTeam (and other clinics and surgeons), as a liaison for German-speaking people to promote their services. She accompanies German-speaking patients to Facial Team in Spain. As you can see here: https://www.srs-in-thailand-begleitung.com/blank-i997o , below the posts she also wrote to defame us. This is a blog post in which she defames 2pass Clinic to then promote FacialTeam, who seem to have people working for them everywhere to seemingly influence patients who are in a very fragile position.

The patient in question was totally happy with her surgery until she met Mona Maier in Thailand. She even was in the process of arranging for a second operation (see email: https://imgur.com/a/pHQ6zQG ). 4 months postop during her consultation with Dr Bart van de Ven she was also very happy. The patient got very beautiful and naturally feminine results, she had her pictures and testimonial online on our website with amazing reactions for months until now. She chose to agree to have them online because she was so happy. You can see for yourself and hear tell how happy she is in the 4 months postop video: https://2pass.clinic/en/before-and-after/detail/8 (you can put English subtitles on).

It is only after she met Mona Maier in Thailand, who works for Facial Team, the blackmailing began. This all because she made a CT scan in Thailand where bone cement was visible (a coincidental finding, she had no sinus problems). The forehead reconstruction type III she had is the one all patients of Dr van de Ven have had since a few years with good results.

2. The patient did indeed get a Type III forehead reconstruction done, not a Type IV . The proposal of the patient clearly mentions they can always use bone cement during the type III procedure (this cannot be overlooked by the patient since the patient is obliged to read everything before she would be able to agree, sign an informed consent, and go through with the surgery). This is mentioned in writing in the proposal the patient received after her initial consultation.

Type IV surgery means they use some more cement (as addition to the Type III) to fill the dent that is present in such patients. This patient did not have this, it was 100% a type III. It was performed legio artis, like Dr Bart van de Ven ALWAYS performs this and will continue to do so.

Other than that, there is an entire paragraph dedicated to mentioning bone cement on the webpage Mona Maier links to, which would be quite hard to miss since it is the first thing that is mentioned when you read about the Type 3:

“Type 3 brow bone reduction—Forehead reconstruction =>

The forehead recontouring procedure we perform the most (since it is indicated most) is called the ‘type III’ procedure by Dr Ousterhout. During this procedure, the anterior wall of the frontal sinus bone is removed, remodelled and put back. Sometimes it is necessary to use a combination of forehead reconstruction and some filling with bone cement to get the desired forehead shape. Dr Bart van de Ven uses the bone cement more and more often to get the exact result he wants.” Much like Mona advises, please do go and take a look at the website so you can read it yourself https://2pass.clinic/en/ffs/procedures/brow-bone-reduction .

Furthermore, Dr Bart van de Ven always explains how the surgery will be performed, and with which materials, on the consultation as well as going into even further detail the day before the operation.

The frontal sinus in women is generally smaller than the one in men, reducing the sinus does not have any negative effect on the physique of a patient whatsoever. There are no patients that now have a “dysfunctional sinus”, and no health problems regarding sinuses can stem from this type of surgery.

3. Dr Bart van de Ven is a registered Maxillofacial surgeon.

You can find his diploma here: https://imgur.com/a/qC6wjZH . He is registered in Belgium. Dr Bart van de Ven has obtained the following degrees: medicine, dentist and maxillofacial surgeon (you have to study dentistry as well to become a maxillofacial surgeon.

This is a very unfortunate, and even more so, a very imprudent accusation as Facial Team actually does have a surgeon (Dr Simon) who is only allowed to work as a dentist in Europe. He has only obtained a diploma as a dentist and after oral surgery in Brazil. He is not a medical doctor, he has not ever obtained any medical diploma. He can only perform oral surgery in Brazil, but definitely no FFS anywhere. As their own website mentions, the only degree he obtained in Europe is one in dentistry. He did not obtain any certificate from his presence at the Department of Oral and Craniomaxillofacial Surgery of the Eeuwfeestkliniek in Antwerp and has not performed surgeries there either, because it would have been illegal.

That the Royal Belgian Society of Plastic Surgeons (RBSPS) doesn‘t have a member/ registration by the name of Dr. van de Ven is very logic: Dr Bart van de Ven is not a plastic surgeon, but a maxillofacial surgeon. He is a member of the professional association of maxillofacial surgeons in Belgium. In our opinion maxillofacial surgeons are to be preferred over plastic surgeons for FFS, as work on the bone level is at the core of it.

Dr Ellen Defrancq has studied general medicine but has never studied to become a surgeon, let alone that she’d be a plastic surgeon. She is simply the manager of the clinic, as mentioned on our website. But what that has to do with the case is not clear to us.

We feel very grateful for those who take the time to read all of the information and use their critical mind. You can contact us in case of doubt or further questions (message us here or e-mail us at [[ info@2passclinic.com ](mailto: info@2passclinic.com )](mailto:[ info@2passclinic.com ](mailto: info@2passclinic.com )) ).

all 19 comments



10
u/cookietrance
Sat Jan 18 17:02:41 2020 UTC
(1 child)

I think this is a matter for a court to decide as opposed to the people on reddit.

13
Works for 2pass Clinic, Belgium
OP
Sat Jan 18 17:23:08 2020 UTC
(0 children)

That we think too. But as Mona Maier posted this publicly on Reddit, we feel we have to defend ourself on Reddit as well. This is the essence of her blackmail: slander our name on the internet. Court cases take a long time. By the time we have a verdict, the damage is done.

3
u/monamtb Works in Medical Tourism
Works in Medical Tourism
Mon Jan 20 11:44:52 2020 UTC
(1 child)

Since the patient and Dr. v.d. Ven were communicating from the beginning of December there was no agreement reached - that is why I published my posts.

Dr. v.d. Ven could have easily solved the situation by inviting the client to Belgium and have a 3D CT-Scan performed to clarify the situation. Since that didn't happen our conclusions were believed to be correct.

I do hereby invite Dr. v.d. Ven to do this since a 3D-CT-Scan for his patient which will reveal what is underneath and if a type III reconstruction was actually done as he claims.
Judging from the 3D X-ray image done at Kamol hospital (no 3D-CT san) this seemed quite unlikely.

Should this turn out to be true I will be ready to apologize for wrong conclusions made based on the 3D X-ray received.
But as said before - Dr. v. d. Ven could have cleared the air before all this was coming and he turned it into a competitor vs. 2Pass/v.d. Ven war - which was never the intention - and that is why most of the comments here are void - since that is not the issue.

Mona Maier

3
Works for 2pass Clinic, Belgium
OP
Mon Jan 20 14:12:42 2020 UTC
(0 children)

Dear Mona,

In the emails we received was mentioned an actual 3D scan of the skull was made in Thailand. An X-ray is not a 3D scan indeed.

We didn't get a request of the patient to make a 3D scan (based on the emails we supposed she had one). The only request we have had is money or else… But we are more than happy to arrange for a 3D CT scan for our patient. Our patient coordinator is going to schedule one with her. Don't hesitate to contact us for information in the future so we can discuss matters like these rather than enter a war neither of us wishes to be involved in. Our door is open!

Best regards,

2pass Clinic

3
u/monamtb Works in Medical Tourism
Works in Medical Tourism
Mon Jan 20 10:24:02 2020 UTC
*
(0 children)

Below is the Email actually sent from the patient who has the issues now - but I was allowed to get a copy.

Furthermore Dr. Bart was asked in a later Email to make a compensation/ solatium offer for the patient which he considered appropriate - which he never responded to.

Dr. van de Ven,

Ich gebe Ihnen hiermit nun letzmalig die Moeglichkeit den Betrag von 12 000.- als Kompensation und Schmerzensgeldforderung innerhalb von 7 Werktagen auf mein Konto - welches Ihnen ja bekannt ist - einzuzahlen.

Ihre laecherliche Antwort ist die Buchstaben nicht wert.

Sollten Sie sich nicht dazu in der Lage sehen, die Schmerzensgeld/den Kompensationsbetrag zu entrichten, so werde ich umgehend saemtliche Kanaele nutzen, um ihr betruegerisches Vorgehen als auch die irrefuehrende Darstellung ihrer Operationsprozedere auf ihrer Webseite, der Allgemeinheit publik zu machen, und dabei auch die Printmedien mit einschliessen ganz zu schweigen vom Setup ihres Unternehmens.

Weiterhin vordere ich Sie letztmalig dazu auf, umgehend saemtliche Bilder und Videos von mir SOFORT von ihrer Webseite und aus dem Internet zu entfernen, da diese nun immer noch ohne meine Genehmigung (die wurde Ihnen mit miner letzten Mail entzogen) auf ihrer Webseite und im Internet zu betrachten sind. Sollten Sie dazu nicht in der Lage sein, werde ich umgehend Anzeige bei der Polizei erstatten.

Auf Susan‘ s.org ist auch die folgende Info ueber Sie zu finden:

What are Dr. Bart Van de Ven‘s Licenses and Board Certifications? « on: May 06, 2014, 03:51:06 pm »

Hello all,

I was trying to find out what Dr. Van de Ven‘s licensure and board certifications are. His CV on his website lists nothing. I‘ve checked the Royal Belgian Society of Plastic, Reconstructive and Aesthetic Surgery (RBSPS), the British Medical Association (BMA), the Royal College of Surgeons of England, Royal Scoiety of Medicine, British Association of Plastic, Reconstructive and Aesthetic Surgeons, and British Association of Aesthetic Plastic Surgeons. But I can‘t find any mention of him.

I finally discovered that the General Medical Council is the council that regulates and certifies doctors in Britain, but his license has expired and has not been renewed since 2011.

So does this mean he is practicing without a license? Does he not have any board certifications? Should I be concerned about this?

Michelle

Wenn natuerlich die geschiedene Ehefrau mit juristischer Beratung zur Seite steht scheinen Sie sich sicher zu fuehlen - sollten Sie diesmal besser nicht.

Ich erwarte somit ihre Zahlung innerhalb der gesetzten Frist, ansonsten werden Sie sich sicherlich einigen unbequemen Auskuenften stellen duerfen - einschliesslich der Antwort, die mir von Ihnen gesendet wurde.

Zudem wird sich das sicherlich auf ihr zukuenftiges Klientel auswirken, was ich dann zum Besten geben kann.

Sicherlich wuerde sich das Yeson Voice Center ebenso ueber einige dieser Informationen freuen.

Mit freundlichen Gruessen

6
u/hrt_breaker
Sat Jan 18 16:12:25 2020 UTC
(10 children)

Meh, squabble all they want but one is clearly better than the other.

3
Sat Jan 18 16:27:40 2020 UTC
(0 children)

What do you mean with this message if I may ask? Is Facial Team better than 2 pass in your opinion or 2 pass better than Facial Team? I read it a couple times but couldn't conclude what you exactly mean :-p?

4
Works for 2pass Clinic, Belgium
Sat Jan 18 21:25:52 2020 UTC
(2 children)

Meh, squabble all they want but one is clearly better than the other.

You call blackmail squabbling? You call illegal medical practice squabbling? These are criminal actions!

1
Sat Jan 18 21:30:19 2020 UTC
(1 child)

I could care less. If I'm a patient, I just want a good result.

One is good, one I wouldn't go to for free

1
Sat Jan 18 22:12:30 2020 UTC
(0 children)

Which one would you not go to for free?

2
Sat Jan 18 22:22:44 2020 UTC
(5 children)

lol

Find me a single facial team result that is as good as this:

https://2pass.clinic/en/before-and-after/detail/43

0
Sat Jan 18 22:23:38 2020 UTC
(3 children)

I'm not saying which on this thread

4
Sat Jan 18 22:25:11 2020 UTC
(2 children)

You don't have to.

Everyone holds up FT as some kind of gold standard for FFS despite most of their work being incredibly mediocre and underwhelming.

1
u/Mmiz
Sat Jan 18 23:13:41 2020 UTC
(0 children)

From what ive seen FT is more conservative. That doesnt have to be a bad thing.
Dr. Bart is definatly a good surgeon and does not come of as a liar. But he does sell surgeries a little hard sometimes. Like if you only want to fix one thing, he might point out other things and ask several times if you sure you dont want to fix that. (have had personal session to discuss ffs with both Facial Team and Dr. Bart)
So Id say if you want max work done 2pass is the place to go, if you rather go conservative and feel better about how you look rn Facial Team.

1
Sat Jan 18 23:08:43 2020 UTC
(0 children)

most of their work

Would you mind being more specific? I'm aware FT is described as looking for a more "natural" aesthetic, but I'm not aware of much specific criticism. Perhaps I haven't looked hard enough.

2
u/ElissaTransVrouw
Sun Jan 19 05:53:52 2020 UTC
(1 child)

Hi doctor Bart, I'm Elissa, a trans woman from Belgium.

As soon as I have saved up the money to get the procedures I desire done, I'm planning on seeing you. I love your results a lot. I also love that 2Pass offers electrolysis, hormone therapy, voice therapy and facial feminization surgery all in one place.

I remember once emailing your receptionist and she guaranteed me that even if I did decide to stop HRT you guys would have been willing to perform facial feminization surgery on me. At the time it was a big concern of mine because due to health reasons I had to temporarily stop HRT. It was a relief that even if I couldn't tolerate HRT there would be a surgical team willing to help me transition. I'm back on HRT now and feeling amazing. I'm seeing you as soon as I have the necessary funds. For me the comfort of having a clinic in my own country (Belgium) that can give me drastically feminizing results but still make sure that I still look like myself is the most peaceful assertion. I'm glad that your clinic also is respectful towards people who may not want SRS in the future. There are clinics that don't see patients who don't want SRS as real trans people and I have had the misfortune to come into contact with clinics like that. I'm glad your clinic has never behaved that way towards patients. I love 2pass. I'm sorry you are being blackmailed. Keep doing amazing work for the community, please.

Much love, Elissa

1
Works for 2pass Clinic, Belgium
OP
Sun Jan 19 09:13:07 2020 UTC
(0 children)

Thank you for your warm message. We look forward to welcoming you in the future!

u/[deleted]
Thu Feb 27 13:56:02 2020 UTC
(5 children)

[deleted]

Thu Feb 27 13:57:43 2020 UTC
*
(4 children)

[deleted]

1
Thu Feb 27 16:55:13 2020 UTC
(3 children)

I'm sorry but I'm confused- what video do you mean?

To clarify, I am not the patient in u/monamtb 's post and my complaints are quite different (for example, I had a Type I forehead surgery). To my knowledge, there is no video, or full-face images of me anywhere on the internet. I am not even on facebook (where one would normally expect to find such pictures or video).

Are you mistaking me for someone else?

Thu Feb 27 16:59:33 2020 UTC
(2 children)

[deleted]

1
Thu Feb 27 17:39:50 2020 UTC
(1 child)

Ah, I see, it was an honest mistake.

It didn't escape my notice of course that in the course of that honest mistake you made some references to my actual complaints, as stated in my post about Bart's incompetence and arrogance and how it damaged my face, here on reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Transgender_Surgeries/comments/ezum3y/ffs_with_bart_van_de_ven_3_years_on/

I am assuming then that the attempt to trivialise my issues with saliva leaking out of the corners of my mouth and to undermine the credibility of my post by disparaging the quality of the pictures I have included in it (several of the pictures in that post were taken by Bart himself in our pre- and post-operative meetings) was an attempt to attack the account of u/monamtb ? I struggle to understand why you would want to involve yourself in that case in such an underhanded way.

In any case, I hope I will not hear anything more from you about the quality of my pictures, or how you dribble a bit when you're falling asleep etc, as if all that had anything to do with my account. Yes?