A less than stellar orchiectomy experience

57
u/mytransjourney
Tue Jan 18 07:00:00 2022 UTC
*
(35 comments)

Hey all! Long time lurker, first time poster. I made this account so I could help the community with some information and my experiences, I hope someone finds it useful!!

I'm a trans woman. I had a simple orchiectomy (horizontally on the scrotum) though Kaiser SoCal in Aug 2020. The process leading up to it was pretty smooth, and they scheduled relatively quickly once everything was in order - only about a month out. I had done lots of research on it and most people said it would be a pretty easy surgery with a quick recovery, like a week-ish. This is still the most common sentiment even now, so I'd like to be the bearer of realistic expectations 😅 Along with some uncommon and unforseen complications I've had to deal with.

Day 0

Waking up from anesthesia was scary. I was in a lot of pain, groggy, and in a bustling surgery recovery room where I wasn't the only patient. Once I was slightly awake enough to know I was hurting, I tried to get the nurse's attention for more pain killers. It took a sec because in reality I was barely moving lol, but she saw me and gave me some. Then I had to wait there until I was was awake enough to be put in a wheelchair and moved out to the car for the ride home. Stressful and blurry. The car ride home wasn't the worst but I barely remember it even though it was over an hour long.

Day 1 - 3

Not gonna lie, it sucked. A lot. Moving hurt. Walking was incredibly painful so basically impossible; I slept on the couch these days. I wasn't prescribed a stronger painkiller than ibuprofen so I was taking it whenever I could. I kept an ice pack on the surgery area, as well as the pubic/inguinal area where most of the pain was. I slept with a pillow between my legs to both keep the pressure on the area and to keep my legs safely apart.

Day 4 - 7

Still sucked, but not quite as bad. Still couldn't really walk due to the pain. (by the way, the pain being in the inguinal area is because that's where they cut the spermatic cord. I actually didn't have any pain on the incision per se, but we'll get to that.) I took a shower and it was really scary. Very painful to stand for that long, I cried a bit from the anxiety.

Day 7 - 14

Not quite as bad. Each day was a little better, a little less painful. By the end of two weeks I was feeling much better, but not back to normal. My second shower a few days after the first was still scary but not as bad. The next was better still. The swelling in the incision area didn't seem to be healing evenly though, over the course of healing it seemed like there was a raisin/small grape swelling on the left side of the incision that was very painful to the touch, and by this point it hadn't fully gone away. Not only that, touching it felt like being kicked in the balls, a very distinct feeling. I messaged my doctor and she said that was normal and should heal over time. Turns out, it was more complicated than that.

Day 15 - 30

By a month, I felt pretty good. I was able to finally walk again! It was quickly tiring but it was doable. I can't remember when exactly I stopped using a pillow between my legs to sleep, but it was probably around the month mark as well. The swelling had gone down significantly but it still wasn't fully gone.

2 Months

Now is when I really started to notice and worry about something. See, that area with extra swelling on the left side was still painful, more than it should be by this point. It was not only painful to the touch, but the area was also somehow numb. It was the left side of the incision, slightly up but below the base. I messaged my surgeon and she seemed a bit surprised. She said that it was very likely nerve damage, which is uncommon but not unheard of, and that there's not much she can do for it. She told me once things had healed more to gently massage the area daily to try to activate it and help it heal faster. That was pretty painful though, so I rarely did.

6 Months

The timeline starts to get fuzzy, but by now the swelling was all gone. I tried to massage the area when I was up to it. The pain in the damaged nerve area was subsiding but still there, as was the numbness. My surgeon reiterated that nerves take a long time to heal and that it eventually would. However, I occasionally started to get aching in the pubic/inguinal area. She said it could be related but idk, it feels different.

1 Year

Same deal. Almost all the topical pain is gone, as is the numbness, but it feels uncomfortable to touch that area too much.

Current, 1 Year 5 Months

Almost all of the numbness and pain is gone. However, I've omitted some details that need to be explained.

I started electrolysis in prep for bottom surgery back in October of 2020. I've tried to avoid the damaged nerve area as much as possible but it still has to get done. In general it's okay but there's been a few times where the nerve has been hit, and again it literally feels like a kick in the balls.

Tbh, I don't know if this is all due to the damaged nerve. I have a theory that the spermatic cord was maybe not cut or retracted fully on that side. It has the same feeling as if the testicles are still there, and it's pretty traumatic when it happens. The latest time this happened (a few days ago), about a half hour later a got a sharp spike in the nerve that felt like a knife. It lasted for a second or two, dissappeared for about ten seconds, then came back and felt stabby again twice quickly. Then it subsided and I've been a bit achy in that area since.

My surgeon prescribed me gabapentin to help with the nerve pain, I picked them up from the pharmacy but I've been reluctant to take it for multiple reasons. Though this latest time was pretty bad and might be what makes me start.

Verdict

Was it worth it? I'd say yes. Those parts of my body were my biggest source of dysphoria. It's been very nice not having to take Spiro, and I halved my estrogen and switched to patches. Tucking is definitely easier now, especially as I used to to get aches in them if I tucked too long. Would I do it again knowing this was a risk I'd be taking? Probably. I asked my surgeon how this would affect bottom surgery and she said it shouldn't, things get moved around and removed anyways. We'll see, I don't super trust her optimism haha.

I searched high and low over trans and cis forums for information on nerve damage after orchiectomy and couldn't find anything. I really hope this post finds someone who needs it, as I've kind of felt alone in all of this. I'm willing to answer any questions you may have, I want to help 💜

My surgeon and team of trans healthcare coordinators has been helpful, so I'm really grateful for my time with Kaiser. My electrologist too has been so amazing and supportive and understanding, I couldn't imagine dealing with this and having someone else. I have FFS scheduled for mid February with Kaiser as well, so I'll be posting an update about that eventually, no pics though.

Anyways, this has been long enough and it's getting late 😅 I hope this is useful!!

Edit: Here's a pic of the scar for those interested. Obviously NSFW!! I'm marking the post accordingly.

all 35 comments



5
u/Mistydog2019
Mon Mar 7 07:46:27 2022 UTC
(1 child)

It's inconceivable that they didn't prescribe real pain killers! What the hell has happened in this country? I was given gaba for peripheral neuropathy in my feet. I took it several months before tapering off of it as it never worked and left me stoned all the time. However, it does work for a lot of people.

1
OP
Mon Mar 7 18:17:14 2022 UTC
(0 children)

I've been taking the gaba since my FFS about a month ago (I really need to post about that!) and it seems to be helping with about 80% or so of the pain. Not as much as I'd hoped, though maybe it will increase a bit over time, especially as it continues to heal. I don't feel stoned but I have been easily tired, though I attribute that to having just had a major surgery lol. It's definitely helping overall, like 80% is better than 0%, but the pain is still mostly there when doing electrolysis and it's scary thinking the nerve could be hit and be as painful as it was before.

The thing is, what if the pain I'm having isn't actually "nerve damage"? The weird numbness and topical pain I normally associate with that almost entirely gone, leaving only the very specific feeling of being hit in the balls when a small spot is rubbed. If that's not nerve damage but is instead something else, can it even heal or be helped with gaba?? What if the surgeon messed something up? Perhaps I should message them again.

u/[deleted]
Tue Jan 18 07:34:00 2022 UTC
*
(1 child)

[deleted]

3
OP
Tue Jan 18 07:42:43 2022 UTC
(0 children)

That might be worth looking into, hmm. It's good to know I'm not alone, thank you 💜

2
u/No-Moose470
Sun Mar 20 18:33:04 2022 UTC
(7 children)

Who was your surgeon? I am also in Kaiser So Cal and starting to get things aligned for my orchi. How long did it take to get scheduled after referral?

2
OP
Tue Mar 22 17:56:00 2022 UTC
(6 children)

Melissa Poh and Amanda Chi. After I got the letter of referral I think it was like a month-ish out for the consultation, and then after that it was literally a month later I was having surgery! Pretty quick.

I will say that now having been on the gabapentin for over a month, it's really been helping. Maybe ask about that? In case you have a similar issue. Hopefully you don't!

2
Tue Mar 22 17:57:32 2022 UTC
(0 children)

Thank you!!

2
Tue Mar 22 17:58:11 2022 UTC
(4 children)

Was this your first time going under general anesthesia?

2
OP
Tue Mar 22 18:06:57 2022 UTC
(3 children)

Yes actually! Since then I've done it two more times, once for my wisdom teeth and another for FFS. Why do you ask?

2
Tue Mar 22 18:19:22 2022 UTC
(2 children)

Oh, it just came to mind as I read your post. It sounded like waking up from Anesthesia after this procedure was hard -- and I kind of wondered if some of that could've been because it was new and you didn't know what to expect? I've gone under general quite a few times now, and the first time it definitely was disorienting and scary and uncomfortable. But in subsequent times, I didn't find it as bad... I mean, it's unpleasant. And twice, I had abdominal surgery where they pumped me full of CO2 and so there was a lot of pain (shoulder is the classic) for 24 hours as the gas dissipated. But I feel like having kind of a mental roadmap for what it's going to be like helps prepare and make it more bearable...

2
OP
Tue Mar 22 18:29:34 2022 UTC
(1 child)

It definitely could have been because it was my first time. I was under for a lot longer during FFS (about twice as long) and I woke up a lot quicker and was a bit more lucid. It still took me about two hours from waking up to actually being able to leave to my ride home, but it wasn't as bad as when I had my orchi. Waking up there was more pain from the orchi compared to FFS though, that could've been a part of it. Plus they didn't prescribe me anything stronger than Ibuprofen for the recovery (compared to FFS where they gave me Norco) so make sure you ask about that if you think you'll need it.

Mental road maps are absolutely and why I made this post! I'll probably write up another one about my FFS experience with Kaiser SoCal here pretty soon. Spoiler, it was amazing!

1
Tue Mar 22 18:32:05 2022 UTC
(0 children)

Yes!! THank you so much for sharing!

3
u/trowayrandoo
Mon Apr 4 06:57:46 2022 UTC
(1 child)

Did you or can you feel the remnants of the spermatic cord? Did you or do you feel any firmness in or near the scrotum?

2
OP
Tue Apr 5 08:43:57 2022 UTC
(0 children)

Feeling with my fingers, I could kind of feel something early on. It was tight but not quite firm. Down there though it definitely felt like the spermatic cord. All of this is in my left side a bit up and to the left of the incision. Now, between the year and a half of healing and gabapentin, the soreness, tightness, and the feeling of being kicked in the balls have basically all gone.

1
u/GreeenTeaWildFire
Tue Jan 18 07:19:44 2022 UTC
(3 children)

thank you so much for sharing your story honey

2
OP
Tue Jan 18 07:41:49 2022 UTC
(2 children)

💜

3
Tue Jan 18 10:01:58 2022 UTC
(1 child)

tell you the truth this opened my eyes, I always thought recovery time would be minimal and without complications, your story really made me realize it doesnt always go as smooth as one plans it out and obviously all the little things one doesnt consider like a bad healing or ingrown hairs, or the spermatic cord, either way Im glad you were able to overcome this hump and carry on now feeling better about yourself

2
OP
Tue Jan 18 12:18:06 2022 UTC
(0 children)

Yes me too, thank you 💜 that was the goal of this post, to help others make a better and more informed choice. I don't regret it at all though, it's all been worth it for me

u/[deleted]
Tue Jan 18 08:13:24 2022 UTC
(1 child)

[deleted]

2
OP
Tue Jan 18 09:24:07 2022 UTC
(0 children)

In hindsight I could've asked for a stronger painkiller. I didn't know what to expect and other peoples' experiences made it seem pretty easy so I didn't plan on a rough recovery. I'm hoping after SRS (hopefully this year) this whole issue won't be as bad. Obviously that's a whole new set of problems to face though, so we'll see.

1
u/HiddenStill
Tue Jan 18 09:34:27 2022 UTC
(5 children)

Would you mind naming your surgeon?

2
OP
Tue Jan 18 12:26:49 2022 UTC
(4 children)

I had a feeling this question would come up. I'm reluctant to because she's really nice, responsive to messages and knows what she's doing. Also I just remembered that it's a team so there were actually at least two surgeons who were a part of it. I've had good experiences with them so far and they're the same ones who will do my SRS. I think it came down to statistics tbh, someone is bound to be the %, ya know. I can still name them if you really want me to but know that I respect them even after all this

2
Tue Jan 18 13:53:58 2022 UTC
(1 child)

Its helpful to others. If we filter out reviews of surgeons we'll end up with bias.

All surgeons have negative stories anyway, its not like any of them are perfect.

5
OP
Tue Jan 18 17:53:53 2022 UTC
(0 children)

That's true. Amanda Chi and Melissa Poh

1
Tue Jan 18 15:50:49 2022 UTC
(1 child)

Maybe just name the facility?

1
OP
Tue Jan 18 18:48:29 2022 UTC
(0 children)

Named the surgeons here

1
u/WheelResponsible3377
Tue Jan 18 14:48:44 2022 UTC
(1 child)

How exactly should spermatic cords be cut? I still don’t understand it fully, as I’ve also seen other trans girls who have undergone this procedure claiming that a portion of the cord is being left and some have even said that they feel how it retracts (scary). Is this a risk with bilateral orchi going through the scrotum? I know that the best way to avoid this is by choosing inguinal orchi, but I’m not really down for the visible scars. Also, can you explain us why did your surgeon choose an horizontal approach instead of a vertical approach where scars could fade away with the scrotum line? Isn’t the scar visible? I’d like to see a pic of the scar, if it doesn’t bother you. Finally (too many question, oops): did the scrotum tissue get affected by the surgery? Has it shrank? Is it just hanging? Does it retract? Thanks in advance :)

Edit: fix some typos.

4
OP
Tue Jan 18 18:21:00 2022 UTC
(0 children)

My understanding is that unless you get an inguinal orchie, the spermatic cord is not 100% removed. With a simple bilateral orchie it's cut high and retracts further up, but a bit still remains. I also think it's riskier to do it through the inguinal canal? It seems it's only done for cancer patients. I could be wrong, don't quote me on that. So I suppose what I'm experiencing is a risk of simple bilateral.

As for technique and a horizontal incision, I believe it was to minimize the scar tissue used during SRS in the future. It seems counter intuitive I know, but my understanding is that if it was done vertically it would cause more issues and tissue wasted than horizontally. I'm pretty sure I read that somewhere but again don't quote me on it haha.

At this point, 1.4 ish years later, the scar is basically invisible. I got the orchie done fully after puberty so it doesn't seem to have affected the skin at all as far as growth or shrinking too much, though it does a little. You know how the scrotum changing skin tightness based on temperature and other factors? Well the skin stays tighter most of the time now, as opposed to fluctuating like it used to before surgery. It did fluctuate for a while, maybe 6ish months, before realizing nothing was in there and staying retracted. It can be stretched out to basically full size though, and loosens when I take a shower.

Here's an image. You can also see the whole area in the context of electrolysis too, if that's something you're interested in.

Hope this was helpful!

1
u/Lexi_Weiss
Tue Jan 18 15:35:08 2022 UTC
(3 children)

Had mine at Kaiser SoCal with pretty similar issues (I’m 10 months out). It took 6 weeks before I could comfortably move around a lot. Numbness finally stopped a month ago, but there is that tenderness you talk about. I’m guessing we had the same surgeon. And she will be there for my gcs as well.

3
OP
Tue Jan 18 18:27:44 2022 UTC
(2 children)

Hmm, that's really interesting. When I messaged her about it she said my issues were uncommon and seemed a bit surprised. Statistical anomaly? Or surgeon error? I'm glad it's healing for you! Do you ever get random "feels like balls being kicked" feelings I described in the post?? Dealing with that on top of the damaged nerve (if they aren't related but the surgeon said it was) has been frustrating.

1
Tue Jan 18 21:13:59 2022 UTC
(1 child)

I do get the kicked in the balls feeling. Like the aftershock feeling, but up around hip level. I, too, was told that my complications were very uncommon.

1
OP
Tue Jan 18 21:57:12 2022 UTC
(0 children)

Fascinating, I get it at hip level a lot too. I really wonder now if this is due to the technique used during surgery.

1
u/mynameisabbydawn
Tue Jan 18 17:20:24 2022 UTC
(1 child)

Thanks for the write up. I’m working towards getting an orchie this year, also through Kaiser in SoCal… hope my experience is smoother than yours. 😬

Any recommendations for the first two weeks after surgery? (Mostly I’m worried that I’ll have to take more significant time off work than I was expecting — I do design/programming so I’m mostly sitting at a computer). Sounds like a doughnut pillow made sitting easier?

1
OP
Tue Jan 18 18:45:58 2022 UTC
*
(0 children)

I didn't actually use a donut pillow at all. I was never told by the medical team I should use one so I didn't bother.

  • Ice is super important to help minimize the swelling and the pain! It was uncomfortable having it on there, especially the first 3-5 days, but it really does help.

  • You'll probably be told to keep pressure on the area to keep it compressed. They don't mean push hard or anything, but I had a pillow between my legs keeping everything situated for at least two weeks, even while sleeping. It helps a ton.

  • Knowing what I know now, I'd say make sure you have someone who can take care of you in case you can't do it yourself. They'll certainly ask who your primary caretaker is after surgery but unless your situation prohibits it, definitely arrange that.

  • They'll also probably tell you to get a stool softener and take it x days to minimize stress on the incision. Do it, and try to eat soft or liquid foods for the first few days. Pooping was a bit painful and scary if there was any strain, especially the first few days. You can get some over the counter or they might prescribe some (they didn't for me)

  • I don't remember what the rules are about lifting heavy things, physical activity, or driving, but if those are things relevant and they don't mention it to you definitely ask.

All in all, you'll likely have a better time than me! After a month, once I was was healed more and able to walk around, I finally felt good about having had the surgery. Being able to message the KP team is really nice, it wasn't always immediate but it was usually timely (just don't message them Friday evening to Sunday night, you probably won't get a response until Monday lol). Wishing you luck!!

1
u/Extension-Cut-2755
Tue Jan 18 18:16:46 2022 UTC
(1 child)

I am not a trans person, just a castrated male. My surgery was gone in a suburban Milwaukee hospital 13 years ago. It was scheduled in the morning with a spinal block anesthetic so I could be awake during the procedure. There were two horizontal incisions near the top of my scrotum so the attaching structures could be extended and cut off as short as possible. And a surgical drain was left in place for 3 days so swelling was negligible. All fluids which drained out were expediently absorbed by a feminine pad in my panties.

I was released and home for lunch about 1 PM with a prescription for Tylenol lll (Tylenol with codeine). All told, I took 2 of them! Yes, only 2! And ice. The next morning I drove to my workshop and patterned around slowly. That evening I attended a high school hockey game - slowly climbing to the top of the bleachers to where I usually watched. It took a couple more days before things were completely normal.

I think the difference in our experiences relates to the technique and ability of the surgeon rather than the surgery itself.

2
OP
Tue Jan 18 18:31:15 2022 UTC
(0 children)

That's crazy fast!! A surgical drain probably would've helped with the swelling but it probably wouldn't have fixed all the issues. I don't know what's caused by what though, your incision sounds very similar but slightly different to mine. I edited a pic in the main post to reference if you want to. It definitely could just come down to technique and skill.